Going Off-Script with Maggie Gyllenhaal

Maggie: I've had two directors tell me that they thought I should lose 10 pounds. And I've always been pretty thin. Also, it's a f****** up thing to say to somebody. Tracy: It is completely, I mean Maggie: Have you heard this thing from Emma Thompson- she said, I would just really not ever diet. Tracy: Okay. So I’m going to launch into these beautiful questions. What would you call the pillars of your wellness practice? All of these things you’re doing, there’s so many different modes. I imagine writing is a different mode than acting and directing. It’s a lot of modes. So what do you... What are these pillars of Maggie’s wellbeing? Maggie: I do think you're right that it's different depending on what I'm doing or what I'm focusing on. I've been thinking, I feel so much better when I exercise consistently, you know, and as you say, I've been doing your workout for over a decade, probably for 15 years. I love to go to class. I know the ladies there. It's super hot. I have my way. I kind of have my spot. Although I'm pretty chill. If someone takes my spot, it's okay. Tracy: She's kind. Everyone loves you at the gym. That was one of the things when I was like, I just would love to sit down with Maggie because everyone loves you and every client that I have. At some point or another, it seems that I get a lot of them coming up -like you said, this person took my spot with this person and everyone's always like, Maggie is the nicest, kindest, most motivating individual. Maggie: Well working out…it puts you in a good mood! Tracy: Yeah. Exactly Maggie: Sometimes I say that to my kids when I'm like, I need to go work out. And they're like, “Oh Momma, No” and I’ll say “It’s gonna make me, it’s gonna put me in a good mood”. Maggie: When I was cutting The Lost Daughter, it shocked me how not physical it is. My husband said to me before I started cutting, he was like, “Well, you're not going to have to be there all the time”. He said, “Directors don't sit there all the time in a cutting room. They come in, they look at cuts” and I realized maybe he'll be like that if he directs. But he didn't. He's never directed. He didn't know. And in fact, with my editor and the process we had, I sat there every second. Tracy: You were like, I’m there every day. Maggie: I was there every second. Yeah, and I couldn't believe how sedentary my life was. And plus it was covid, so I wasn't going to the gym. To your gym. And I didn't have a set up workout situation because I had just been shooting in Greece. So that was probably the least I have moved in a long time and I found it hard. I found it weird. I started to walk from Brooklyn to the West Village to the editing suite because it was deep covid, it was pre-vaccine. Tracy: Right Maggie: I wasn't even taking taxis. I wasn't on the train. That I'm still sorting out, I think in regular times that again, would be like writing, I would work out early. Tracy: Right Maggie: Then go straight to the editing suite. But I don't know what to do about it when I'm actually on set. I don't think there’s... I think something has to give. I don't know. Tracy: Why can't we just do pop-ups? Wherever Maggie directs a movie, there will be a pop-up. There will be a Tracy Anderson pop-up. It won't be pretty. Maggie: Yeah, but remember, I mean think about on The Lost Daughter if we'd had a Tracy Anderson pop up it would have been Olivia. Jessie. Dakota. Tracy: That would have been amazing! So first of all, that would have been so dreamy but the main, the lead character… Maggie: Olivia? Tracy: Olivia! There is something about her that is so sensual and incredible! Maggie: This is delicious Tracy: Which one, the salad? Maggie: Both of them Tracy. Yeah. There's something about her... her physicality is so special, deep. Maggie: Olivia, yes Tracy: I mean, deep. I don't know, I loved that film so much, but I have to say that I'm not the only person to tell you this but when the child was lost, I was almost like, I love Maggie and I want to watch this so badly. But I know, if that child is gone, I can’t. I had such a difficult time at that moment. But then I'm so glad, of course… Maggie: I mean we play with that, the feelings around children being lost or whatever, all the complicated feelings we have that happen all the time. Tracy: All the time! Yeah. And I see it, too. One of the things I loved, so many women have so much pressure to be this perfect parent or these relationships, they've predetermined that my relationship with my child is going to be perfect. I'm sure you keep your relationship really tight and all of the things, but watching this imperfect, you know, relationship and representation of that. Motherhood is not always what you think or what you set out. And yeah, the deep somatic experiences that live in us, you know, when things are imperfect, I loved all of that. I thought it was all so vital and important, but we could also see so much in her acting, every moment of her physicality was just so spot on! You could feel all the feels with her! Maggie: In her body. Tracy: In her body. Maggie:I know, I know, I know. I had a woman stop me in the store the other day and say, “Olivia's body in that movie”. She said “To see a body, this sensual, gorgeous body that looks like a real human being”. Tracy: Yeah. Maggie: “That isn't utterly controlled”, which is what we're used to seeing. It really moved her, and I agree there's something… when I see that. That's something nice about going to class. Tracy: Yeah Maggie: When you see real bodies of women our age. Humans. Working hard, you know, to me it's, it's friendly. It's the opposite of competitive. It's really inclusive and I love that. Tracy: I love that. I love that that's what you feel. I was just talking to this doctor this morning. This amazing, preventative doctor who is trying to do all of… he wants to change the system of health. Maggie: Right. Tracy: And I was telling him I was like, sadly, you want to go through the health lens, I want you to be healthier, right? So I'm going to help you with all these things to be healthier. But I've noticed with my audience for many years if you want to motivate them to become healthier and that is your objective for most of them, you have to speak to the vanity. Most of it comes from the competitive nature. It is just a self-imposed competition of where do they sit and exist in the lineup of the standard of beauty? And if doing something healthier for themselves will make them more beautiful… Maggie: Yeah Tracy: Then they'll do it. Maggie: Yeah. I feel that. I mean, I understand, right? I understand. Tracy: Right, but I was like, listen, this is all great, but you're going to miss the opportunity for a huge audience here. You got to let them know that the key to being more beautiful is also knowing yourself. And I think that that's what the woman that stopped you about Olivia, she sees Olivia loves her… I don’t know Olivia. Sorry Olivia, I could be totally wrong but it appears that Olivia trusts herself. Maggie: Well, she's a genius. I mean, she is. She's a genius. I can't speak for how she feels about her body. Or even her artistic genius. But I know she's a genius. Tracy: She's a genius. Yeah, well, we need to learn from Olivia, because if we could get more women like that to walk into their spaces, their feelings. You know, we need a master class with you and Olivia. Maggie: I mean, here's the thing. I think probably what initially motivated me to start doing your workout was wanting to look better. Tracy: Right. Maggie: And probably some kind of expectation on myself, which was insane, to be honest. But, you know, I mean, I think that was probably the initial motivation. The older I get the gentler I am on myself. I mean, I only found out recently, really sometimes I look at myself, like my body, and I'll be like, “I look good, I look fine”. Tracy: You look amazing! Maggie: You know what I mean, though? I'm not going like, “Oh my God, what is this !” Tracy: And analyzing Maggie: I sometimes do. I also now have these moments of the clouds clearing where I'm just like, “I look good, I look fine. I'm happy with this”, you know? And it's just gentle. I am more gentle with myself. Tracy: I love that, I'm doing the same thing, by the way, because things are going to… things are going to change. Maggie: Yeah. Tracy: And sometimes they change in, clumps. And sometimes too, it's like, with social media, sometimes people message me or whatever, and they're like, “What is your foundation ?” I'm like, you have the same foundation, swipe right! Swipe right, and you have the same exact foundation. It’s fabulous. It's called Paris. That’s the foundation! Maggie: Yeah, right Tracy: I did a terrible thing to my body for so many years. I mean, everyone said I would regret it, my mom the most. I went to the tanning bed for a horrific amount of time. It was horrific! Tan tan tan. Maggie: What does it do to you? I've actually never done it. Tracy: You were so smart. You lay in a bed of radioactive lights... to burn your skin, to become tan. I mean, it's terrible. It's horrible. Maggie: It's like laying out in the sun? Tracy: It's ten times worse than laying out in the sun. But they used to tell us that it was better when I was in high school. Anyway, whatever. I mean, in Indiana, they told us it was better, right? But I was addicted to it in some way. And now I'm like, wow! On my skin- the sun damage or the loss of collagen. There's no, you can’t drink enough collagen. At some point we have to be gentle with ourselves and also be honest about where we went. I'm like, Tracy Anderson you went to the tanning bed, what did you expect ? Did you really, you know… and you're not going to back out of this. So you have to just be kind, make it the best you can. Maggie: Yeah. Tracy: Be happy you’re still here. And thank goodness, no skin cancer, thank goodness. But you know what I mean? I like that approach of people looking at themselves. They are so hard and so many women spend so much time dreaming about being in somebody else's body or dreaming that their body is capable of becoming something that it was never meant to become. Maggie: Yeah. This is what I mean about the thing this woman said to me about The Lost Daughter. When I'm around people who look human. Tracy: Yes. Maggie: And healthy and they care about themselves. But humans. It makes me feel good, you know what I mean? I feel, oh you're like me. You know, but have you heard this thing that Emma Thompson… someone asked her, "What would you tell your younger self?" And she said, "I would just really not ever diet". Tracy: And she’s beautiful Maggie: She's beautiful you know, she's like, it oppressed me. I understand that. And to hear Emma Thompson, this queen, say that. It had an effect on me. Tracy: Yeah. Maggie: I mean, not to say that that's what's right for everybody at all. I'm not saying that. I'm just saying, it suppressed me too. Tracy: If you want to live longer and everything else, this is what Maggie: I do, I want to live longer. Tracy: I know I want to live longer, too. But there is balance. My grandmother lived to be 96. She smoked a pack of cigarettes a day. Right? Maggie: Exactly, I know. Tracy: There is something about the security of, Emma Thompson knows what is right for her, what is right for her body. Maggie: For me, when I work out, I feel better. I just feel good. I feel happy. Even if, and I said this to you when you came to my party, even if my body doesn't look that different, I mean, no, it does. But even if it's like oh I skipped Tuesday and Wednesday or whatever and Thursday, I feel worse about myself for some reason. Not really because my body has changed. Not at all. But because it makes me feel good to do it. But I find if I get too fussy about what I eat and cleanse or whatever, it makes me anxious. Tracy: Yeah Maggie: As soon as I'm like, okay, I'm going to do that, I'm going to cleanse, or whatever. Immediately my life becomes more anxious. Tracy: So how would you describe your relationship to your physicality when you first explored acting and how has it changed over the years? Because talking about all these physical things and talking about an industry that has put so much pressure on your physical body. Maggie: Oh yeah. When I first started auditioning and acting and stuff, it was a time when you could say all sorts of crazy things to actresses. I've had two directors tell me that they thought I should lose 10 pounds. Tracy: Wow Maggie: Yeah, and I've always been pretty thin. Ten pounds. Tracy: That's a lot Maggie: Also, it's a f****** up thing to say to somebody. Tracy: It is completely. Absolutely. Maggie: It only occurred to me just now that two different directors said that to me. I think that both of them said it as a kind of manipulation. They were trying to make me feel something which they managed to do. But still, that's crazy. And I was being told all the time, you know, you're not pretty enough, you're not sexy enough. Can you sex it up a little? Tracy: The Secretary? Has anyone seen The Deuce? Maggie: But this is like, I would wear something I thought was sexy and go to an audition and then go get that note. Tracy: Get that note. Women will take those, carry them and then stop exercising because they'll say, Somebody told me, I'm not this in my body or I'm not that in my body. Did they ever get that deep? Or, how did you process that physically? And get it out of your system? Or did it weigh on you for years? Maggie: I didn't really grow up exercising very much. I was on the swim team when I was in junior high. I was always a really good swimmer, but I didn't have… My brother played soccer, so he was always working out and I never really did. When I went to college. And so because of that, I wasn't, I think, really in touch with… I'd be like, why is this happening? You know, why do I feel good about myself today? And, you know, 20 minutes later I feel terrible about myself because it's all just imaginary. Tracy: Yeah. Maggie: If you're not in touch with your body Tracy: Absolutely Maggie: Then when I was 19 and I was going to college in New York, my aunt, who was only, I don't know, 18, 15, 18 years older than me, my dad had a lot of siblings. She was a dancer. And she invited me to go to Jivamukti with her, the old Jivamukti. I mean, this must've been like ‘96 or something. And it was in an old loft, not the fancy Jivamukti but before that. And we go and we start doing yoga. And I had never been in touch with my body like that. And I got obsessed with yoga. The high, the heat. I think I’m a little addicted to the heat. Tracy: Because you like to connect. You're smart. That's the thing, your brain, it gets your thermo regulating system immediately, like boom it's on and it's connecting more things. Maggie: So yeah, and I like that. I'm kind of anthemic, something's happening. I'm different when I walked out of this room, then when I walked into it. So that was when I started to get really physical and I was like, “Wow, I feel so much better”. And so in a way, when these guys said this to me, I had a, like you say, I had a connection to my body. I had a sense of myself. It did hurt. And I mean, I'm remembering it now, obviously I didn't completely go away. I think when I was younger, my goal was to be as thin as possible, and that was the ideal. But I wasn't ever able to… Tracy: Do the things to get there. That's exactly my story as a dancer Maggie: Or to get so far over there. I was like, okay, but I still do want to have a little something to eat. You know? I could, I could never. But I still think that was the goal for a long time. And I just wasn't willing to sacrifice all that much, I think. And thank goodness for that. Tracy: These things, these nuances that happen, especially to women, you know, I think throughout the years, you know, a director so easily saying to you, presumably male saying that to you. You need to lose pounds or you're not sexy enough for this or that, that today people can just go on, which we were talking about a little bit before, they can just go on to your Instagram page and just criticize you so openly all over the place. This is something that's always been happening. You know, I would have this conversation with someone the other day where it's like, I don't like this for kids because they know if they're not invited to something, I was like, we knew if we weren't invited to something Monday at school. I knew if all my friends slept over and for some reason I wasn't invited. I didn't know that moment. But I knew in a delayed way. Right? So these things have always been happening. But I think that the advice of how you don't let it bring you down or you don't own their remarks or opinions. Maggie: I think my response at the time was just to be really fierce, you know, f*** that or whatever. In order to get through it. And then how much of that was put on? I mean, some of it was certainly put on. Tracy: The rest, you left on my floor in sweat, the sexiest sweat I've ever seen. I love how, because I'm interested in the process of working with fellow actors, especially when the script requires a level of physical vulnerability. Because I think that for me, getting people to be physically vulnerable with themselves, to try a lot of different abstract movements, to move their hips in a certain way or to not lock their spine and all of that. Yeah, it's so interesting. And I think as a director, what does that process look like for you? Maggie: That's such an interesting question because as you put it that way, I think, yes, sometimes in your class there's some gorgeous trainer moving her hips in some way that probably usually I wouldn't move my hips. And I'm like, yeah, okay, let's do it. And, like I say, all the other women around me are doing the same thing and how, how freeing and great and that is. Tracy: And safe. It's like, yeah, we're doing this! Maggie: Well, also, can we just talk about this then I'll answer your question. But the dancing element is such a gift because of course, the muscle stuff and there are moments where you're certainly moving the body in ways that you definitely wouldn't. But dancing has so much attached to it, both the kind of embarrassing side of it, and then also the extreme pleasure. I've often thought, because I'm not a great dancer or anything. Tracy: You can dance. You know, you slayed those routines early on, I’ve got to say. Maggie: But the pleasure of actually dancing for a half an hour or however long, really dancing all out. Dances you've learned in a room full of people to loud music. What that does to your day, I think is really notable. Tracy: When all of those women set out to learn the choreography of just even those original dances. I was just so moved. I can't believe I'm getting this, because in my first study, I had and I did I grouped different people and I'm like, okay, if I'm doing the muscular structure and I let you go run because you like to run or you've been running, I'll see if I can change the imbalances that you think you feel, right? Or you are going to ride bikes. And I found that, I’m not saying you shouldn’t run and do all the things that you love. I'm saying that if you want to create balance where there's imbalance and this very lean, balanced, muscular structure. And then you go and you do the same thing over and over, it disrupts the design, but the dances and the rotation and I wasn't sure that everyone would learn that. And then there were, of course, like many jazzercise and hip hop aerobics, you know, all these things before me. But no one, took the stop and go out of… everything was built upon and now we're going to do this. And now it's that. It was built upon in the industry and I was like, I can't have that. I need people to actually learn the choreography. We're going to jump, we're going to bring the cardio up. And you're going to be bouncing like you’re at a club for, all that time. Those original dances, we still do them to this day. Maggie: It’s so much more fun for me than running. Tracy: Yeah. You know it’s active? Maggie: And it's different, you know? You're changing things.. You're moving your arm here. Running is just very… and I know for some people, like my husband, for example, that it’s very meditative. Tracy: Yeah and he's not going to come learn the dances… Maggie: No, he's not. But maybe. He's a sick dancer. Tracy: Right. Okay. Yeah. He might really like MYMODE though. Maggie: He might like the dancing. Actually. But you were asking me about supporting people in their bodies as a director. I have a couple of things to say about that. I mean, one is and you were saying in particularly in vulnerable ways, you know, I've done a lot of sex scenes in my life where I've been naked or, you know, really engaged physically with somebody else. Peter, my husband, says something really interesting about sex scenes. He's like, they're actually one of the most fake things in a movie because of course, it isn't sex, it's pretend sex, right? Whereas in fact, you're trying to create, say, in a scene where you're full of anger, you're trying to actually create anger. Right. But you're not going to actually create sex. So. So there's already a scene. because I've done it with, you know, all my actresses and there were other scenes. In fact, in the movie, all of them were engaged in some kind of intimacy when we were shooting. All of them said that they felt really comforted by the fact that they knew that I had done this. And it's funny, I almost took that for granted. I was like, yeah, I know exactly how to take care of you and protect you and keep an eye out and make sure you're safe. You know, I think it can be the idea of an intimacy coordinator, which is somebody who's there just to watch out for people who are doing sex scenes. That got invented on The Deuce. When I was acting in it. Tracy: Wow I have never heard of an intimacy coordinator. That’s so interesting Maggie: So there is always a stunt coordinator who's there if you're going to do pretend violence. Right? And so there was an actress on The Deuce who really helped to invent this. Tracy: That’s so smart Maggie: She was saying it's very similar. We want to make sure our bodies are protected and that we feel taken care of. And at first I was doing the nudity stuff and here's this person, you know, showing up who's an intimacy coordinator. And at first I was like, I'm good, you know, I've got this. I have all my ways. We figured out all the ways that me and the costume and makeup, we figured out how we're going to protect me and I'm good. And I've been protecting myself for 20 years. But then I saw. I really saw the value. I saw the value for really young actresses. Who had an ally and needed an ally. And then, in fact, ultimately, in the end, she ended up being really helpful to me too. And I was glad to have her. But on my film, we didn't have an intimacy coordinator. I was talking to my actresses about it, and they were like, we trust you. We know. And it's true. It's like when you're an actor. Before there were intimacy coordinators, when you were the young one, an early beginner, someone would look out for you. It depends who. Sometimes it's your makeup artist, sometimes it's the costume assistant who's running in with a bathrobe for you between each take. Sometimes it's another actor in the scene. And then as you get more experienced, at least in my experience, I would be the one looking out just to make sure. Hey, guys, somebody needs someone. Someone needs to be bringing her a bathrobe in between every single take or whatever. Tracy: Well, in that, in that film too, because there was so much that these characters were carrying and one of the things that I found so beautiful about it was that you… I don't know, there was something different about that film in terms of the layers deep, that the physicality went for me. And this is what my whole career was about. And I'm like, wow, every little thing, I felt it through each of their bodies, which I think is obviously such an important part of being an incredible actor. But, I did just really see that in that film. Maybe this part of it was just so well cast with people who do understand how to get to that. Maggie: Well and also creating a space where people are really, really free. You know, you can be a great actor, but you're in a position where someone has told you before you had a chance to understand the scene that you're in. You know, the director says, when I was alone in my room imagining the scene where you started at this chair and then you walked over here and then you come sit back down here on this line. Okay. But to say that to Olivia Colman and not give her a chance to sort of feel out the room and how does she want to play it? And she's like, “oh you have a Breakfast at Tiffany's record there. I want to be looking at the records” right. And so to create a space where everybody is free to sink into what it is that we're really doing, I think that's how Tracy: You created that space and that's the thing together again, I mean, not to relate it so much, but that’s one of the reasons why I don't talk to people during the workout. I literally thought there was so much science behind the brain connections and activity. If I am not in your space during that time, there's the music that you're listening to, you're just tracking someone, but you're, you're tracking and you're absorbing it into your own body. You are going to end up becoming so much more powerful for yourself than if I'm like, “Listen, Maggie, you don't know how to lunge”, right? I'm going to tell you how to move. There's plenty of time for conversations and development and form and reach and all of that to happen after the game, right after you've had your time. Maggie: That's interesting Tracy: To just explore yourself. Yeah. So I think it's amazing that you create that space Maggie: You're so right. You're like, okay, let's say you were saying I don't know how to lunge, but I’m still only going to have whatever capacity I have. Yeah, right. And I find doing your work out that, you know, it's different each week so you'll start the program that week and you'll be like, “My God, this lunge it's killing me”! You know? And you're just doing the best you can. And then, you know, on day three, maybe you're looking a little more carefully and you're like, “Ooh, that looks really cool. What she's doing. She's okay..let me see if I can adjust” and… Tracy: I feel like these intimacy coordinators, I feel they're beneficial in life, period. There are clients that I would like to schedule intimacy coordinators with. Maggie: Interesting and, how would it help? I know you're kidding. Tracy: Almost like a therapist. I do. I really, really do. And I have to just commend you for being so vulnerable in so many roles, representing so many different women and also freeing your body from.., it's still this is your body. But when you are going to be that vulnerable and you're going to just get naked in a scene, it's so important to our progress as women. I mean, it's so important. I find. I just see, the reason why I'm saying the intimacy coordinator for people is that I do see that so many people feel ashamed about their body, feel disconnected, feel like they have to cover everything up. Maggie: Yeah. Tracy: And I actually wrote this in a weekly newsletter a few weeks ago that their assignment was, I need you to spend at least 15 minutes with yourself naked, because no one does. We're covering up here, covering up in your pjs. I don't know how many people actually sleep naked with themselves or their partners, but I'm like, you need to spend some time because it doesn't matter what size, shape, age. It doesn't matter if you're losing the collagen in your skin. It doesn't matter for any of it. It matters that you know it and appreciate it and can look at it. Like you said, you know, I look good or I'm noticing this Maggie: Or “I look okay”. Tracy: Or yes, “I look okay”. But then you also have to be able to go, you know what? If your stomach just keeps, gaining weight and gaining weight, you can know. Hey, I'm noticing that, right? I actually have some power over that. Maggie: Right Tracy: I don't have to go wild and freak out, but I can start, maybe half of this stuff. You know, you can do something better. I'm going to actually move and exercise. Maggie: Right Tracy: But not freaking out about it. And I think too, hormonally with… I don't know, are we that… I'm definitely older than you, but we're not that far? Maggie: I'm 45. Tracy: I'm going to be 48 in a month. Yeah. I mean, I knew I was going to be older than you, but when you are… I can see it coming, like menopause. I'm not there. I still have regular periods, but I can. I can see it. It's going to come. It's going to be there. And I think when you do move and you do know your body and you don't fear your body and you are able to be kind, to be your own best friend. That person said that, yeah whatever. You will be able to handle things like all the hormonal shifts or the tough things in life. I've been through some really tough things. I've seen some traumatic moments, you know, and it's like when you've got yourself and you're processing it physically, you're moving through it physically, it's easier to navigate. So back to the intimacy coordinator, if somebody was there to gently let people know in a safe way, I'm looking out for you, but you can, you know, you can move the hips, you can take off the sports bra. People come to me and say, they're always like, cover your boobs or lift your… And I'm like, I don't want to. I like to move free in my body. I nursed for eight freaking years. I don't, you might associate that, but I am. This is just me moving free in my body, right? You know, so I just think that freedom, I don't know there's something great about the title, an intimacy coordinator. Maggie: I don't know. It doesn't sound very sexy, but I guess that's the point you know? Tracy: That’s the point. Maggie: Exactly. Tracy: Coordinating intimacy. Maggie: It's almost like, you know, what it should be and what she was for me. Ultimately, because at first I was a little like, I got this. Okay, I've been doing this for 20 years. Tracy: But what she ultimately was for me was, like you say, she was just someone who had her eye on me, who I knew, which, you know, to be honest, it's what I often want from a director. What I would like to offer to the actors who I work with, I do offer this to them. I have my eye on you. Not just in terms of that image stuff, but in general. Like, what you're offering me. I am seeing it. Tracy: But you like people. That's why you go into the gym with the people and you see another person, you like to see truth and honesty. Maggie: And also, I mean it's different to be naked on screen and be naked in a film that's very vulnerable. And in some ways, although in some ways less vulnerable because you have the freedom of fiction. Tracy: True Maggie: You know, it’s still your body, but actually in life I'm like you with the boobs. I get naked in the tiny dressing room. Tracy: Yeah, right. Maggie: I don't know, I don't feel, it doesn't make me shy. I feel there's such a nice freedom in skinny dipping and, you know… Tracy: What advice would you give to people in similar careers where their bodies are linked directly to their profession? Maggie: I don't know if this is advice, but I think that humanity, the ways in which the human, meaning, the real, the not totally controlled, the ways in which those aspects show up in our bodies I think are the most beautiful. Tracy: Yeah. Maggie: And also, you know, if you think about it like, you know how you're saying a lot of people don't spend time with themselves naked. If you think about the parts of your own body that are, that feel the most vulnerable to you. Which it might be totally out of whack with how you actually look. Right. Objectively. But still, this feels really vulnerable to me for whatever reason. I bet that so often your lover or a lover would find those things the most beautiful because they are the most vulnerable, because they are the place that accesses you the most directly. Don't you think that about your own lover? Tracy: I absolutely do. Maggie: Like, ooh, that's the place that only I see. Tracy: Yes, 100%. I cannot wait to see what you're writing and what you're going to direct next. It's amazing. And you also broke a really important place for female directors. I mean, to break into that and be seen and valued like that. That took a lot of that fighter in you, you know? Maggie: Yeah. I think when I was younger I just didn't even consider it an option because there were so few people around me that were women that were doing it. Tracy: Yeah Maggie: Yeah a lot of things changed around me that made it feel possible. I mean, first of all, I was playing a director on television, making porn. And I, I kept saying to David Simon, if this is someone who's… it's life or death for her. Right? This is how she's going to survive. And it's about money. It's life or death over the producorial surreal aspects of making porn that is a very different person than it's life or death as an artist, right. Like it's life or death because she's a filmmaker and because she's seen something that has woken up in her, not about money, but about film. About art. And so I think in some ways I almost manifested it in The Deuce and then manifested it in life. And there's no question it's a better job for me. There's no question what I… Tracy: The directing over the acting? Maggie: Oh yeah. Tracy: Or directing The Lost Daughter over porn. No, I'm just kidding. Maggie: I only directed fake prom. Tracy: I know. I'm joking. Okay. Can I put you in the hot seat? Maggie: Okay. All right. Is this where I say things quickly? Tracy: It’s quick. Favorite thing about living in New York? Maggie: Restaurants. Tracy: What is your favorite restaurant? Maggie: All of the Ignacio Mattos restaurants. I like Altro Paradiso, Corner Bar. I also really love Via Carota. I love Romans in Brooklyn. I am a foodie. Tracy: And this is the city for it. One actor you’d love to direct? Maggie: Daniel Day-Lewis. Tracy: Yeah. Pretty phenomenal. Best soundtrack of all time? Maggie: I love In the Mood for Love and Talk to Her by Almodovar Tracy: I have not seen either one of those. Maggie: They’re good Tracy: You know, I love music, so. Okay, go to weeknight dinner? Maggie: Ottolenghi. You know, they have this recipe for turkey zucchini meatballs. I love that one. It's really easy. Turkey, zucchini, meatballs. And I make a little sort of yogurt sauce Tracy: Last film that truly spoke to you? Maggie: Okay. I just recently saw Biutiful. It's misspelled B, i, u, t, i,f,u,l. Something like that. It's Javier Bardem and it's directed by Iñárritu. And it's just, it's just such a good movie. I have Tracy’s dog right here. I watched it recently and I was like, how did I miss this movie? Tracy: Best advice on parenting? Maggie: Oh my god, you should never give people advice on parenting. Tracy: What is a core value of parenting that you have? Maggie: I think teenagers in a way are giving you another opportunity to kind of not make up for but take a look at the mistakes that you made when they were little. Which of course, you made. Tracy: I agree Maggie: And so then I guess right now I'm thinking about really being able to go, okay, you're right, and I'm sorry, even about small things. Tracy: Yeah. Maggie: Another thing I'm thinking about is really not putting my own worries, issues, and difficulties into them. Tracy: Yeah, that's my biggest challenge. I am a huge worrier. And so my brain tends to go to the worst case scenario of everything and it literally will think about all of the dangers and all the worst case scenarios. And then I feel I have to verbalize a lot of them to my kids so they look out for them. Maggie: Yeah. Like how we inadvertently pass these things into them. And I really don't want to do that. And then one other thing I would say that I'm thinking about now is, who really are my children? As opposed to what I imagine they are, what I wish they would be, what I fantasize they would be. but how cool it is, who they actually are, you know? Tracy: So good. You're so smart, You're a genius. You're an actual genius. 100%. Maggie: No. Olivia Colman is though. She can have that. Tracy: Which one of my studios is your favorite? Maggie: Tribeca is my one, it’s close to Brooklyn where I live. That’s my one, they know me. That’s my vibe. I always go to the 9:00, 9:30 class. Tracy: That’s the spot Maggie: Actually I like to work out at 6:30. At night. Tracy: Really? Maggie: Yeah because sometimes it just gives you that high. Tracy: Yeah. If you can get a good sleep score. Then great! Maggie: I can Tracy. Good. I love it. Your biggest source of inspiration? Maggie: Other people. Tracy: Yeah. Community is so important, and having good relationships with other people it's really important to our health. Maggie: Yeah. Tracy: We’re really meant to be, really for each other, you know? Maggie: Yeah Tracy: This is so nice. I only made it through a little bit of my cupcakes and things like that. But you're so fascinating and amazing and I just really… Maggie: This is so great, you have been so generous and wonderful to me. Everyday, I'm grateful for you. Whenever I go to work out. It really has such a positive, nourishing effect on my life. So it is a pleasure to sit with you. Tracy: Thank you.